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Thread: can the internals handle a small amount of nitrous on a modded 6mps

  1. Default can the internals handle a small amount of nitrous on a modded 6mps

    what is the maximum torque/Bhp that the stock engine internals, injectors and gear box etc can handle.

    Current mods include custom 2.75" full turbo back exhaust, Corksport SRI and TIP, CP-E HPFP, CP-E FMIC and custom ecutek tune running at 310Hp/360Ibft ( on dynodynamics flywheel figures)

    Rather than going big turbo, im considering fitting a progressive nitrous injection kit to my car. nothing crazy, just a 25Hp or 50Hp shot from about 3500rpm-6000rpm with a proper progressive controller module to custom set it up.

    would this be a bit dodgy on the standard rods


    cheers guys

    Sy

  2. #2
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    well, i know 2XS has a car with stock internals running at over 250fwkw (~325wheel hp) so i guess it's possible
    wouldnt know for certain

    to the forums btw

  3. Default

    cheers mate.

    i know the Hp wil be well wihin the limits. its the torque that im worried about. the 3 nitrous'd cars ive seen have all made about the same additional torque as the HP gain.

    if its already running at 360Ibft, could it manage another 50Ibft or more? if i could get away with a bigger shot say 75Hp max id comsider that, but then were talking potentially 435Ibft of torque and i dont really want to start bending rods or snapping transmission parts etc

    SY
    Last edited by vRSy; 30-08-2010 at 07:45 AM.

  4. #4
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    Have a look through the blown engine theory thread.
    It's not going to answer your question, but it is interesting.

    There are plenty of stock engines blown, plenty of modified aswell, so I don't really think there is a clear answer to your question.

    Question for 2XS if he reads this, or for anyone else that knows.
    He has a different turbo right?
    And a different wastegate?

    If so, and he's running that power without failures, that could lend even more weight to the sticking wastegate theory of blown engines

  5. #5
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    Nitrous is dangerous. From what I am led to believe, nitrous can ONLY be used at absolute full throttle. It can't be fed in on a slight take off for example. It HAS TO BE FULL THROTTLE ONLY, monitored by a switch to tell the controller you have full throttle. Nitrous is a science so be very careful. Call some places that specialize in Nitrous first. And remember, Nitrous is illegal on our streets. Can only be used on the track.

  6. #6
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    these cars above 320-330whp u start to run into trouble. troy knows his car, what he is doing.if ur running 310hp 360lbs atw ur on the safe side of rod throwing! put the money into pistons and rods, wind the boost to 20+psi with aftermarket turbo u will do 400whp and be safe

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by luke 3mps View Post
    these cars above 320-330whp u start to run into trouble. troy knows his car, what he is doing.if ur running 310hp 360lbs atw ur on the safe side of rod throwing! put the money into pistons and rods, wind the boost to 20+psi with aftermarket turbo u will do 400whp and be safe
    +1
    MPS is gone. Ghey Trail enabled....Not Happy. MPS 6 to come

  8. #8
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    Plenty of 255hp at the flywheel (aka standard) engines blowing as well. So ITS NOT the amount of power being produced. But higher power can certainly add to the problems.

    Again, read the blown engine theory thread.

  9. #9
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    key here is FORGED PISTONS AND RODS DO IT

  10. Default

    uke 3mps
    these cars above 320-330whp u start to run into trouble
    what is that in flywheel horsepower. our dyno's always give figures at the flywheel.

    Grajy
    Nitrous is dangerous. From what I am led to believe, nitrous can ONLY be used at absolute full throttle. It can't be fed in on a slight take off for example. It HAS TO BE FULL THROTTLE ONLY, monitored by a switch to tell the controller you have full throttle. Nitrous is a science so be very careful. Call some places that specialize in Nitrous first. And remember, Nitrous is illegal on our streets. Can only be used on the track.
    its not dangerous when used correctly. i would also be using the top of the range controller so id be able to set up exactly what amount of nitrous gets sprayed in each gear and in what RPM range at what throttle input etc. plus it would be set up on a dyno to check for knock and fueling issues. it also has built in cut offs for the event of to much knock, fuel starvation etc.

    Id be using wizards of nos to install and set up the kit i i go ahead. Also nitrous is legal for use in the UK roads though mate

    what would you reccommend for strengthening the engine. just uprating the piston rods, or do both the pistons and rods need to be changed. this would involve me having to get a another tune due to the compression ratio changing though

    also where is the engine failure thread? cant seem to find it.

    cheers for the replies guys

  11. #11

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    It could be dangerous, it might not be. It all depends if you got a Monday (I'm fresh from 2 days of rest and I won't let any imperfections past) build or a Friday arvo (I'm ready for the weekend, let's just let this one go like this) build.





    Seriously, I've got a 100Hp shot of NOS for mine, I've just been to scared to fit it at the power level I'm at (fully std engine internals, including fuel pump)

    Yes, I have upgraded the turbo and I'm actually using the original wastgate actuator to run it. Never had it stick open either.

    Personally, I think the cars go boom when driven from "open loop" to "closed loop" tune and vice-versa. I have noticed a slight "stutter" when going from cruising into accelleration.
    Achievements
    2009 Jamboree Street Compact Winner
    Aust. Quickest and Fastest MPS
    12.3 seconds @ 111Mph.
    Proven over the Qtr mile

    Another Mazda 3 MPS - Almost fully bolted - Waiting for a turbo upgrade - The weekend hack.
    Toyota Yaris - Coilovers, rollcage, raceseats, harnesses, 18s - Also waiting for a turbo upgrade.
    2011 AWD Territory - White and Slightly lowered on 22s - The tow car.
    2011 RWD Territory - Black on black and slammed on 22s - The family transporter.

  12. #12
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    what do u mean by open loop to closed loop troy?Thanks

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by esp22 View Post
    what do u mean by open loop to closed loop troy?Thanks
    the ECU runs in 2 different loops. I don't remember which is which, but, for example:
    Open loop: The ECU is continously learning, retuning to suit your driving style,
    Closed loop: The ECU runs off the factory (or reflashed) tune, which is usually on WOT

    The WOT tune is when all STFT and LTFT are 0.0
    Achievements
    2009 Jamboree Street Compact Winner
    Aust. Quickest and Fastest MPS
    12.3 seconds @ 111Mph.
    Proven over the Qtr mile

    Another Mazda 3 MPS - Almost fully bolted - Waiting for a turbo upgrade - The weekend hack.
    Toyota Yaris - Coilovers, rollcage, raceseats, harnesses, 18s - Also waiting for a turbo upgrade.
    2011 AWD Territory - White and Slightly lowered on 22s - The tow car.
    2011 RWD Territory - Black on black and slammed on 22s - The family transporter.

  14. #14

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    Closed loop is normal driving. (crusing) ie its getting feed back from oxy and maf sensors and adjusting trims/timing/waste gate duty etc etc with full feedback

    Open loop is it setting XYZ parameters on the fly from the sensors, with pre determined figures (learned from driving around in closed loop)
    Open loop occurs at Wide Open Throttle (WOT)

    Cheers
    Doc

  15. #15

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    also when in open loop (assuming your ECU is happy and your maf calibrations are not too far off.. your LTFT will be at zero.. however your STFT will be 18+%.. even when stock



    Doc

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    Closed loop is normal driving. (crusing) ie its getting feed back from oxy and maf sensors and adjusting trims/timing/waste gate duty etc etc with full feedback

    Open loop is it setting XYZ parameters on the fly from the sensors, with pre determined figures (learned from driving around in closed loop)
    Open loop occurs at Wide Open Throttle (WOT)

    Cheers
    Doc
    Told you I get them mixed up
    Achievements
    2009 Jamboree Street Compact Winner
    Aust. Quickest and Fastest MPS
    12.3 seconds @ 111Mph.
    Proven over the Qtr mile

    Another Mazda 3 MPS - Almost fully bolted - Waiting for a turbo upgrade - The weekend hack.
    Toyota Yaris - Coilovers, rollcage, raceseats, harnesses, 18s - Also waiting for a turbo upgrade.
    2011 AWD Territory - White and Slightly lowered on 22s - The tow car.
    2011 RWD Territory - Black on black and slammed on 22s - The family transporter.

  17. #17

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    going back to NOS.. you would neeb a wide open throttle flash of sorts before considering it.. I would not like to be spraying NOS at 5500 RPM and have thr throttle start to close

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