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Thread: Meth/H20 Injection

  1. #1

    Default Meth/H20 Injection

    Ok well I grabbed that Devil's Own Meth/H20 kit off of JMac and I am going to go about installing it over the next week or two. I'm pretty sure I've got the whole cold pipe bit worked out now, the pretapped one being from a 3 and I own a 6. My main issues are working out the wiring and placement.

    Anyone know where the best place to tap into boost would be? The BPV? I think I read somewhere I can put a T bit in there and and some extra tubing and it should be sweet.

    The other thing is can anyone think of a good place to mount the pump? It should be lower then the tank (which I will put where the old intake stuff was) but orientation doesnt matter. I would then need to figure out how to bolt it down. I don't really want to do any drilling into the car either.

    Once I have this in I'll keep you guys updated on how it goes.

  2. #2
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    Yes, you can tap into your bov line with a t-piece for the boost switch, it isn't important to have the tank above the pump with this kit, once the line is primed and providing you don't run out of fluid you wont have any issues with air in the line, the nozzle has a check valve incorporated into it, when your pump is inactive the system is closed, thereby retaining line pressure.

    Check out the US forums for some mounting location ideas, there are some great discreet boot mount set ups that have been done with the 6's over there, just need to get a longer hose to the engine bay.
    Nearly all men can stand adversity. But if you want to test a man's character - give him power.
    Abraham Lincoln

  3. #3

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    Ok so it has been a while but I'm trying to get this all squared away over this weekend.
    I found online a guide for how to remove the front bumper and I got that off yesterday. I inspected the area and took a few measurements etc. to try and figure out how I would mount everything coming up with an idea on using aluminium etc. to do it. I planned to mimic this way of mounting as close as possible.
    http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...ailsafe-55184/ (seems mazdaspeed forums is down atm or at least I can't connect)

    So today I was planning to go get some stuff so I could bend my aluminium to perfect 90 degree angles etc. etc. when I had a closer look at this funny fellow


    Some stupid plastic junk mazda put in to make the car quieter I guess. Originally slated for throwing away. However on closer inspection....

    That's a convenient space there... almost a pump size space.... :O

    It is a pump size space!



    It'll even bolt straight back up in the stock position! No drilling, no screwing around with anything but my horrible brackets as you can see! It also won't push back on that soft plastic bit which could result in bumping into the wheel. Now it wasn't perfect, it had a small hole in the bottom, but I just drilled that bigger and plan to use it to mount the intake for the pump. It also pokes up into the engine bay so throw a cap on top and away you go!.

    So coming up next the thing is incredibly dirty and will need a very thorough cleaning and inspection before it goes into use. I also need to mount securely the intake nozzle or whatever it is called for the system as the hole I drilled is a tiny bit too big. I reckon epoxy and silicon sealant should do the trick here. I have actually considered buying a new very clean one from Mazda but I'd probably have to pay through the nose for that :S
    Once that is all done, I will mount it up, wire the pump in put in the controller stuff and tap into boost, swap over cold pipes for the tapped one and we are done!
    Last edited by Nepharius; 09-07-2010 at 05:40 PM.

  4. #4

    Default

    In terms of performance, how did it all go? After a decade of car modding, I almost have enough bits to rig up a kit, and I've been thinking of doing this - to reduce carbon build up if nothing else. Did it make any difference to either power or efficiency?

  5. #5

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    You'll have to wait till I finish, should be done this weekend or so. Just waiting on my OBD2 interface so I can accurate boost readings to make sure it will activate at the right time and then away she goes.

  6. #6

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    Any progress on this? I've been thinking about getting a kit lately but would like to know your thoughts

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    I installed my kit the other weekend, (Devils Own stage 2 kit), all I can say is that I wish I had done it sooner, last week with the heatwave in Sydney, whenever I got on boost, the car felt like it was driving around on a cool winters day, watching the IAT & BAT temps on the dash hawk were fun, even in the lower pump output range the BATs would drop at an unbelievably fast rate, I have the 4gph nozzle, pump starts (15%) at 4psi and maximum output at 14 psi.

  8. #8

    Default

    Thanks for the info Matt, got a few question for your if you've got time
    - Where is the best place to buy meth and roughly how much does it cost?
    - Is it street legal to use?

    If i'm not mistaken the stage 2 kit comes with the controller to allow you to adjust how much meth is injected in relation to boost. Its my understanding that the system achieves this by adjusting the output pressure of the pump however i have read that due to the possibly low starting pressure when the system firsts begins to spray the meth may not atomise very well as the nozzles are designed to run at a higher pressure. Did you do any testing to check the atomisation of the meth while the pump is running lower pressure?

    Good to hear that your pleased with the results
    Last edited by Toddy22587; 07-02-2011 at 02:34 PM.

  9. #9
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    OK, to answer the first 2 questions
    -Metho, it is just as good (if not better) than ethanol, Bunnings 5lt for ~$12, runinng a w60/m40 mix.
    -As far as I'm aware it is illegal for road use (hence my stealth like install)

    Stage 2 kit comes with the progressive controller, it works on a modulated output, rather than a percentage of output, so the pump at its lowest setting is at 15% PWM, so its 100% power over 15% of time, if you have ever seen one of these pumps in action its more of a pulsating spray, rather than a constant spray, even at 4psi, there is quite a bit of air going through the system, and whatever hasnt evaporated in the intake mani, will only serve to steam clean your pistons. In the instructions it says that too much spray at any given time will usually cause bucking from the engine, mine is set at the recommended setting of on at 1/4 boost, full at 3/4 boost.
    Nearly all men can stand adversity. But if you want to test a man's character - give him power.
    Abraham Lincoln

  10. #10

    Default

    Methylated spirits (metho) is 95% Ethanol.

    Is there any difference between running Methanol or Ethanol?

    I can buy pure methanol for $50 / 20L locally but it would be more convenient to just use metho

  11. #11
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    Either one should work just fine, I found that a place near work sells methanol by the litre so I might give that a go, most likely a bit cheaper than buying metho in 5l bottles from Bunnings.
    Another recommendation is the use of de mineralised water rather than just usual tap water.

    Edit....oops just realised I left the m of my earlier post, typed ethanol, instead of methanol. I think the reason methanol is the more popular choice in the US is the cost factor, I believe it is substantially cheaper than ethanol (methylated spirits).
    Last edited by MattMPS3; 08-02-2011 at 03:33 PM.
    Nearly all men can stand adversity. But if you want to test a man's character - give him power.
    Abraham Lincoln

  12. #12

    Default

    They recommended methanol for more consistent results, however it is incredibly poisonous so working with it is a bit dangerous (10ml will blind you 30ml will kill you and the fumes aren't great for you either). As for water probably depends where you live, I think Melbourne water was good enough. The water here in Canberra tastes different and I am less sure about using.

  13. #13
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    I guess a lot of it comes down to what your expectations are of the kit, my goal was more so the chemical inter-cooling benefits, and a bit of peace of mind that the higher octane will aid in preventing knock (hence the 60w:40m ratio I use). If you are tuning around the meth, which I would NOT recommend with these entry level kits, then product consistency is a major issue.

  14. #14

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    I'm not planning to run anything crazy because I need to keep my stock internals for a while so its more for cooling and cleaning then anyhting else.

    Whats the main difference between these entry level kits and the serious ones?

  15. #15
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    Serious kits have flow meters in them, if they detect under a certain amount of flow (e.g blocked nozzle) they can trigger a switch, this could be a warning light, or in more extreme cases, can automatically open the wastegate, or switch tuning maps on the ECU to a more conservative (non meth ) tune, or all of the above.

  16. #16

    Default

    Yeah you would need to a pretty fancy unit one with ways of detecting loss of pressure, flow and any other failures before you'd tune Meth in. I know that if I tuned it in on my car I could have an extra 7kw but if it ever failed or I forgot to fill it up etc. etc. the engine would do damage to itself. Not really worth the risk. Im starting to consider swapping to one of those variable controllers. Atm I only hit 10psi when I put the foot down hard so I barely use the kit ever, although it is good to know its there when I need it.

  17. #17

    Default

    Sorry to dig up an old thread, but i would like to send my thanks to @Nepharius for showing me this idea, i had planned to tap my water resovoir for my WMI but this worked out better!

    a few pics:

    Installed water/meth tank (from old air resonator) pic shows float switch (for low level sensing) abit of the tank and the drainage tap.




    Low meth level flashing red LED indicator:




    Tapped and fitted nozel into intercooler (cold side) - mounted as far from throttle body as possible to allow adequate vaporisation before entering combustion chamber.




    Engine bay tank snorkel extended and expanded using capped PVC fitting:




    On - Off switch for whole kit (Red switch on right)

    Last edited by Rayd; 08-09-2012 at 08:00 AM.

  18. #18

    Default

    Glad it worked for somebody else, it's like Mazda designed it to fit a pump! Hardest part of installing the pump in this place for me was cleaning out the resonator, mine was filthy! Also think the mechanic may have thrown out the cap I used on the top, allowing for it to get dirt in there again after I got a service. I like the filler solution you put in. Would do that myself except that I've got a corksport air box I am trying to put in. All going well it'll fit and I'll just have to open the lid when I want to refill. May look at putting in a flexible bit of tubing with a cap a bit like yours but smaller to allow me to refill with less screwing around.

  19. #19

    Default Meth/H20 Injection

    Quote Originally Posted by Nepharius View Post
    Glad it worked for somebody else, it's like Mazda designed it to fit a pump! Hardest part of installing the pump in this place for me was cleaning out the resonator, mine was filthy! Also think the mechanic may have thrown out the cap I used on the top, allowing for it to get dirt in there again after I got a service. I like the filler solution you put in. Would do that myself except that I've got a corksport air box I am trying to put in. All going well it'll fit and I'll just have to open the lid when I want to refill. May look at putting in a flexible bit of tubing with a cap a bit like yours but smaller to allow me to refill with less screwing around.
    Ye i know! The pump just fits perfectly there!

    Only thing is im a bit paranoid about how clean my reservoir is and i want to drain it but I'm trying to work out how to drain it!

  20. #20

    Default

    You can always disconnect the water line in the engine bay and then manually turn on the pump to do a visual check of how clean the water is. For mine to do this you just have to take the signal wire from the pressure sensor and ground it, but that will probably differ between setups etc.

    Only way I've ever managed to drain it is to pull of the bumper and pull the whole thing out, pain in the arse but easiest way to do a proper clean.
    Last edited by Nepharius; 09-09-2012 at 08:53 PM.

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