thanks for the info. like i posted. link doesn't work for msf thread. is private forum.
thanks for the info. like i posted. link doesn't work for msf thread. is private forum.
I'm not about to copy/paste the entire thread, it's a fair assumption to make that you'll be registered (Free) to the worlds largest Mazdaspeed forum... if you're not, sign up!
When we have information, i'll share. We are waiting still.
Still waiting for a resolution. We are trying to push it along as best we can.
Still waiting?
been fixed, new brackets should be sent out soon...
We test fitted the new brackets on our car and they seem to have taken care of the issue. The new brackets are already on the way to the owners of the four pot kits.
Bumping this up.
Just got an engineering certificate for the 4 pots in the ACT.
Engineer had no problems with the Wilwood calipers, tested them an they passed with flying colours, including not messing up brake bias.
The brackets are also fine and passed with no problem.
The hoses and fittings from Fast Brakes on the other hand...
Fittings from hose to caliper: he took one look at them and simply said "that's not how you do brake fittings". The kit uses these L shaped threaded fittings.
The first issue with these is that they are simply threaded into the caliper using some PTFE tape and without torque specs (other than a warning to NOT over tighten them else you will break the caliper), making the correct seal difficult to get - you are just guessing.
He more serious problem is that they don't rotate with suspension movement. Every time the hose moves, the L is bent back and foreward and the thread is tightened and loosened, particularly if the brake is being applied and there is lots of pressure pushing on those threads. The result of this was mangled caliper threads and a leak appearing after a few weeks of use!
My engineer took these off straight away, re-drilled the caliper to 3/16" and put on some proper banjo bolts and crush washers. He also attached the banjo to the caliper so that they wouldn't rotate at all when the brake line moves.
The hoses: He initially assumed that they would have some US certification stamped onto them, meaning he could probably get them certified under the ADR without much hassle. This was not the case, there were no markings anywhere. I ended up getting a new set made up locally and just re-used the grommet (that locates the hose on the shock) from the Fast Brakes kit, and ditched the rest.
In summary, for anyone ordering these, I would suggest you get your own brake hoses and banjo fittings made up (it's not very expensive), and DO NOT install the Fast Brakes ones. But if you do this, these will pass ADR and be Aus legal with no problem.
And also clean your disks more often :P
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Last edited by Lachlan; 11-04-2014 at 11:11 AM.
Fast: RayD Tune|COBB AP|JBR|Stratified|CP-e|Xforce|Autotech|Denso|Corksport
Turn: Bilstein|Eibach|Whiteline|JBR|Hankook RS3
Stop: Wilwood 4pots|Custom lines|DBA T3|Remsa|TRW 600
Rice: JL|Alpine|Focal|MiniDSP|Rota g-force|2XS|Cree|Celestial Blue FTW!
I'm a big fan of wilwood but these calipers only use what looks to be 3/4 of the disc, surely something isn't right?
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Fast: RayD Tune|COBB AP|JBR|Stratified|CP-e|Xforce|Autotech|Denso|Corksport
Turn: Bilstein|Eibach|Whiteline|JBR|Hankook RS3
Stop: Wilwood 4pots|Custom lines|DBA T3|Remsa|TRW 600
Rice: JL|Alpine|Focal|MiniDSP|Rota g-force|2XS|Cree|Celestial Blue FTW!
Fast: RayD Tune|COBB AP|JBR|Stratified|CP-e|Xforce|Autotech|Denso|Corksport
Turn: Bilstein|Eibach|Whiteline|JBR|Hankook RS3
Stop: Wilwood 4pots|Custom lines|DBA T3|Remsa|TRW 600
Rice: JL|Alpine|Focal|MiniDSP|Rota g-force|2XS|Cree|Celestial Blue FTW!
Awesome. Thanks. Hot pink rotors coming up!
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I suggest that @EdgeAutosport.com take these changes on board to make the brake upgrades safer.
http://www.ozmpsclub.com/forum/edge-...tml#post289178
It was a good pickup by the engineer. I wonder about others who have installed these...
Not sure what the requirements are as to displaying compliance for the US-DOT standard. But this is something that Edge have confirmed that it is US-DOT compliant. See http://www.ozmpsclub.com/forum/edge-...tml#post275472. I hope that they aren't skimping on the brake lines or told me porkies....
Last edited by lup15; 11-04-2014 at 03:23 PM.
This is the response from the our contact at Fastbrakes (the company that manufactures the brackets to make the wilwood parts fit with the mazdaspeed).
It should be noted that the brake lines are wilwood brake lines and are the same style and in some cases, the same lines used in many racing applications.The ‘L’ fitting is the standard -3AN to 1/8 NPT style fitting used on most racing designed calipers designed and sold in the US. There are some slight differences in that some hoses have the ‘L’ built into them and the fitting in the caliper is straight.
Hoses are specified to be slightly longer than stock to compensate for the suspension movement. This is the first I have heard of a car with the hose moving back/forth on the fitting, but I’m certain it can happen if it isn’t routed and secured properly.
While I agree that the banjo style hose attachment would seem to be the best, until Wilwood starts making the calipers that way we have to use the current hose designs. Thousands of cars are out there with the Wilwood calipers on them and they seem to be fine with the way the lines attach. I think hose routing and securing is the area to be looked at, not how the hose attaches to the caliper.
So it doesn't look like getting them changed is going to be an option on our end.
Thats quite a shame. I understand that in the racing environment it isn't much of a problem, particularly as there isnt as much suspension travel, but on the streets, thats not a risk that should be taken.
I am not sure how you market the brakes, but I think that this should be highlighted as 'race applications only'
Thanks for chasing this up.
I'm not a brake expert so I won't comment on the fixing, other than what I was told by the engineer.
There is nothing actually wrong with the lines, the problem is that there is no droid of certification. My engineer looked for a tag or engraving on the lines showing their compliance with US certification (can't remember the name) - if this was there he said he could almost certainly get them certified if the US standard was equal or higher than ours (he said this is the usual process with imported lines). But without any markings, they have no way of certifying the lines so they can't pass.
If these could have a tag, then I think all that would be needed for road use would be to get a cheap banjo bolt with an extra retaining bolt/bracket and they would be good to go
They are, there is actually a disclaimer on the paperwork saying "off road use only"...but that disclaimer is also on almost every other aftermarket part.
With replacement banjos with an extra fixing bolt/some kind of bracket they are fine. And if this is done before fitting them up, it would be fairly simple and cheap, just the cost of new braided lines
Also, despite all the bitching, I do love these brakes in the end!
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Fast: RayD Tune|COBB AP|JBR|Stratified|CP-e|Xforce|Autotech|Denso|Corksport
Turn: Bilstein|Eibach|Whiteline|JBR|Hankook RS3
Stop: Wilwood 4pots|Custom lines|DBA T3|Remsa|TRW 600
Rice: JL|Alpine|Focal|MiniDSP|Rota g-force|2XS|Cree|Celestial Blue FTW!
I will see what I can do. I was told these were DOT certified, but I'm beginning to doubt that now.