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Thread: HPFP nessasory or not?

  1. #1

    Default HPFP nessasory or not?

    HPFP necessary or not?

    Hi guys I have a Corksport SRI & TIP as well as a Cobb AP with the stage1 ots map runs great and I love it. But I was thinking of up grading the stock Intercooler for an aftermarket top mount and came across varied views on the need for an upgraded HPFP.

    I have been having a look round the cobb site and found this…

    https://cobbtuning.zendesk.com/entri...sure-Fuel-Pump


    Mazda DISI High Pressure Fuel Pump
    [IMG]file:///C:\Users\Peter\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtmlclip1\01\ clip_image001.jpg[/IMG]
    Aaron
    posted this on November 09, 2012 02:22 pm

    The Mazdaspeed DISI engine has proven to be a remarkably stout and tunable platform. That being said we have found that it has one major limitation, the factory "High Pressure Fuel Pump" .
    Unlike a traditional fuel injected gasoline engine that runs a relatively low fuel pressures, roughly 30-40psi. Mazda's Direct-Injection requires very high fuel pressure upwards of 1,600psi. This is accomplished with a mechanical fuel pump driven by the valve-train.
    This mechanical fuel pump is unfortunately undersized for the engine. When we make more power from these engines it is not uncommon for fuel pressure to drop and the engine to run lean.
    If you own a Mazdaspeed and plan to run one of our higher performance maps such as any Stage 2 map or even a Stage 1+Inter-cooler map you will need to upgrade this pump, the exception being some Mazdaspeed6/Mazda 6 MPS/Mazda Atenza MPS vehicles which has a more capable pump from the factory. It is important to monitor your fuel pressure!



    So how do we work out if we here in Australia have a up rated HPFP?
    I'm not keen on spending the extra coin on a pump if I don’t need it and I’m not looking to tune it massively in the future. However I don’t want to get the IC and discover that it causes issues.

    Any and all input is greatly appreciated.

    Pete

  2. #2

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    * should read- HPFP necessary or not?

  3. #3
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    Default

    Last edited by SarcasticOne; 09-05-2013 at 01:24 PM.

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    And my awesome mspaint picture explaining why/when it's needed...
    http://www.ozmpsclub.com/forum/showthread.php?p=232165

    It's down to the tune if you need an upgrade

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

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    Default

    IF stage2 THEN hpfp

  6. #6

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    Yeah I have read all the posts before effectively re posting a well discussed question however for them to say what they said on the cobb website was strange and why I asked the question.

    Is there anyone that has run an intercooler or a DP with no pump?

  7. #7

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    Yeah I have read all the posts before effectively re posting a well discussed question however for them to say what they said on the cobb website was strange and why I asked the question.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jmac View Post
    IF stage2 THEN hpfp
    Ok, so it only stage 2 ots maps? not how it reads on the cobb website but as I had posted above there are some conflicting views on this.

    Is there anyone that has run an intercooler or a DP with no pump?

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pistol Pete View Post
    Yeah I have read all the posts before effectively re posting a well discussed question however for them to say what they said on the cobb website was strange and why I asked the question.




    Ok, so it only stage 2 ots maps? not how it reads on the cobb website but as I had posted above there are some conflicting views on this.

    Is there anyone that has run an intercooler or a DP with no pump?
    Yup. Ran a DP, stock IC on Stage 1 for ages. No problem

    Just upgraded the pump and now on stage 2


    Peter "SLIXX"

    Snapped by Tangcla - FB Page
    Currently RaydTuned
    Lots of love from 2XS Racing & Dan's Garage Detailing

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    Quote Originally Posted by slixx View Post
    Yup. Ran a DP, stock IC on Stage 1 for ages. No problem

    Just upgraded the pump and now on stage 2


    Peter "SLIXX"
    Hey Pete, did you do the internals or swap the whole pump over?
    2XS RACING $ CORKSPORT $ MAGNAFLOW $ ​UNSURE MOTORSPORTS $ COBB $ INJEN $ FULCRUM $ FEDERAL TYRES $ VISUAL GARAGE $ ADVANCED PERFORMANCE CENTRE $ B C M $ NGK $ STRATIFIED $ AUTOTECH $ DBA $ REMSA $ DGR $ MORIMOTO $ JBR $ FUSION

  10. #10

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    Auto tech internals


    Peter "SLIXX"

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    I ran a Dp and diff TMIC for some time with no issues ,also had SRI and TIP ,but and heres the issue .
    The car was not pushed IE not too many WOT, for extended times.
    It was a calculated risk ,considering all the known facts available at that time.
    Stage 1 Map ,should be no issue running OEM fuel pump,as long as you treat the car with some respect.
    Once i decided to Ecuteck tune and optimize the add ons, i beleive it is paramout to instal upgraded internals .
    It would seem as though ,you have invested some bucks at this point and are looking to further upgrade to dp and tmic ,so to really benefit from these mods and safe guard your investment , the spending for fuel pump internals would be wise.
    Way to many mods, way too much money spent,way way too much time spent = the wifes no 1 Enemy.
    But i,m Smiling

  13. #13

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    According to Brett from MRT , pump is not required and can be tuned around stock pump. I'm running stock pump no probs.

  14. #14
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    Thanks to the OP for starting this thread and for everyone's input. This has convinced me to go ahead and order Autotech internals via Edge Motorsports. For anyone interested they are selling these kits on special ATM for $349 (US) saving $50-. This means i'll receive the kit shipped for less then $400-. Seems cheap for the piece of mind.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by chef View Post
    According to Brett from MRT , pump is not required and can be tuned around stock pump. I'm running stock pump no probs.
    Yeah, I pointed out he actually reduces turbo spool on the car compared to stock tune when he made that post on Facebook...

    It was also a car with just an intake, no exhaust/intercooler/turbo upgrades

    Never got a reply...
    Newbie FAQ My Build Thread
    From stock, to GT3071, to substantially less modded, many lessons learned!
    3" HTP | 100 Cel DP | Autotech HPFP | AP V3 - Self Tuned on E20 | JBR RSB | CPE S2 REM | JBR Shifter Bushings

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by chef View Post
    According to Brett from MRT , pump is not required and can be tuned around stock pump. I'm running stock pump no probs.
    !!! COBB > MRT

    Why tune 'around' something when you can replace it and tune OVER it.
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    -=PG SRI - PG Inlet - ETS TMIC - GFB Hybrid BOV - Best Mufflers DP - Eibach Pro - AccessPort STG2 - Autotech HPFP - ITV22 - Michelin PSS=-

  17. #17

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    I have experienced issues after having Ecutek tune DP, TMIC and TIP. Did a 14.17 drove around a while. I drive it hard from time to time. Put about 10K on it and then started noticing some surges when changing from 3rd to 4th. Went to springy motors for a dyno day and could only get 160kw on the dyno when SLIXX was bone stock and got 169Kw. After some logging I could see the fuel pressure dying between 3rd 4th under load. Changed the fuel pump to CPE and logged car. A1 after that. Don't change it if you want but it will remind you down the track under load. Tuning around a problem is the wrong way to go. You want to optimize the car not DE TUNE IT.

  18. #18
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    BTW, dropping pressure is dangerous and can lead to ZZB.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by SarcasticOne View Post
    Yeah, I pointed out he actually reduces turbo spool on the car compared to stock tune when he made that post on Facebook...

    It was also a car with just an intake, no exhaust/intercooler/turbo upgrades

    Never got a reply...
    What do you mean reduces turbo spool?

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by LOOPYMPS View Post
    I have experienced issues after having Ecutek tune DP, TMIC and TIP. Did a 14.17 drove around a while. I drive it hard from time to time. Put about 10K on it and then started noticing some surges when changing from 3rd to 4th. Went to springy motors for a dyno day and could only get 160kw on the dyno when SLIXX was bone stock and got 169Kw. After some logging I could see the fuel pressure dying between 3rd 4th under load. Changed the fuel pump to CPE and logged car. A1 after that. Don't change it if you want but it will remind you down the track under load. Tuning around a problem is the wrong way to go. You want to optimize the car not DE TUNE IT.
    I think the Gen2 pump was more of an issue than Gen 1, very good advice though.cheers

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