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Thread: MPS FWD vs AWD

  1. #21

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    Your examples at Wakefield is more about driver rather than car. If you look at the lap times, the MPS' fastest time was 1:08.3225 compared to the Evo's 1:06.520. Even the Sti had quicker fastest laps in every race. No doubt though that Jake is a very good driver given his consistent lap times and ability to push the MPS.

  2. Default

    my best answer to date has been that english (?) guy who came out for a round of the australian rally in a fwd civic and left the awd corollas in his dust. skilled driver will out shine a chump with great gear and no skills every time.....

  3. #23
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    ive driven a few of the awd turbos!!
    the latest was the evo x
    amzing handling, you just dont seem to get that boost feeling of the 3.
    same can be said with the 06 wrx i drove fairly regulary!!
    and the lag... o dear!!
    ms3 does seem on the edge somtimes!! but its fun!!

  4. #24

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    The question was about the drive configuration, not driving skill. The bottom line is we were not given fwd for a dynamic advantage. If you did high school physics refer to Newtons third law.

    The dynamics of awd are complicated so I'll compare fwd to rwd.

    In a rwd the harder you accelerate the more weight transfers to the rear, giving more traction to the driving wheels and allowing even greater acceleration. In a rwd you can achieve 100% rear weight transfer. The only limit to accelerating ability is the level of adhesion at the rear wheels.

    A fwd on the other hand transfers weight away from the driving wheels under acceleration. The harder it accelerates the less traction remains available at the driving wheels to accelerate and it quickly becomes self limiting. Making a fwd quick involves a constant battle against the physics involved, and the natural limits can never be overcome.

    When you throw cornering into the equation, the limit of adhesion in a fwd is reached even sooner. Street cars rarely push these limits so the limitations of fwd are usually only encountered in racing. That's why you'll never see an F1 car in fwd configuration.

    If you have a fwd then work with it to the best of your ability, but you're only doing yourself a disservice by denying the physics involved.

    When all other things are equal, a rwd or awd will accelerate and corner better than a fwd.

    Here's an example of 100% weight transfer to the driving wheels.




    Gone to Volvo


  5. #25

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    Another disadvantage of FWD is tyre wear and grip, as the front wheels do not only the steering and braking, but also have to try and put power to the ground. AWD has this to a lesser extent ans less power is at the front wheels. RWD cars are even better as the rear wheels focus purely on acceleration with the fronts dealing with the steering and (most of) the braking.

    As kmh001 said you won't see cars designed purely for performance/handling/racing in FWD config. Back on topic, your friend is right Tone, FWD does not have any benefits over AWD except that it's cheaper to produce, loses less power to the drivetrain and generally lighter.
    Last edited by Nuliaj; 20-05-2009 at 02:20 PM.
    Nuliaj: Hatches are only really half a car anyway.
    shinslinger66: And you forgot to add that they are also a girls car!

  6. #26
    coops Guest

    Default Fwd v awd

    Have just bought a fwd mps and have an awd rex at home. Both feel the same cornering(both get understeer) advantage goes to fwd as far as money is concerned tho, lighter without 2 diffs and you only go through 2 tyres instead of 4 at a time! In the wet tho the rexy comes out!!

  7. #27
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    Going back a while in the UK Ford did the fwd Sierra XR4i and an XR4x4. Both had the same amount of power with a 2.8l V6 (150bhp ). The 4x4 had a slightly lower top speed (heavier, more drivetrain loss), was quicker from a standing start (more grip), and was easier to drive fast. On the limit handling was much better in the awd car.

    Having said that, the MPS3 is a very capable car - the weight advantage makes up for a fair bit of the grip difference with a 6. Through twisties though pushing hard, I prefer the rock solid feel that awd gives, and the ability to get on the power very early and power out of a corner. My 6 will still understeer if pushed into a corner too hard, but once you learn how to make it go around corners well it's great fun. Just as I am sure the 3 is also once you get the hang of it.

    At the end of the day, awd costs more, so an awd car like the WRX for the same money as an MPS3 will have some other compromises somewhere. You pays your money you takes your choice - I'd be happy with any of them if there was no other choice. But choice there is, and that is alllll good.
    2009 VW Passat R36 - 220KW of German engineering.
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  8. #28

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    The reason I go AWD rather than FWD is that it's cheaper (feasible) to mod to overcome the weight and power advantages of FWD. It's alot harder to mod a FWD to overcome the advantages of AWD.

  9. #29
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    regardless of times AWD is a hell of a lot better than FWD. if FWD was the best all performance cars would be that. its obviuosly not so AWD, RWD is much better.

    FWD front wheels do too much, they gotta brake, accelerate and steer. FWD will alwasy be slower round a track than AWD. even same power outputs, AWD will always win.
    (depending on driver)

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by remotegt View Post
    FWD will alwasy be slower round a track than AWD. even same power outputs, AWD will always win.
    Depends on more than just the power and the driver. Chassis, brakes and suspension. As most MPS owners who track their cars will have found out by now, most competitors are out half way through the day with fried brakes, some AWD cars can't keep as faster apex speed and some drivetrains waste so much efficiency that they can't get enough power to the ground.

    Plus... Understeer is also a flaw some AWD platforms share

  11. #31

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    Im sorry I agree with Jeev

    The Mazda 2 showed how a FWD can out perform many cars with twice the speed, by being able to put the power to the tarmac around the corners without losing too much power.

    I have been to track days...and seen HSV with fried brakes after a few laps...other more expensive cars too.

    Too many variables to compare which is better on the track.

    Happy Motoring
    duglet

  12. #32

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    ooo let the war begin all right... let him take up shinslingers AWD fully MOD'd... lol he will loose then!

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Latool View Post
    ooo let the war begin all right... let him take up shinslingers AWD fully MOD'd... lol he will loose then!
    Dont send others to do your dirty work
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