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Thread: Car feels slow after Cobb AP flash

  1. #1

    Default Car feels slow after Cobb AP flash

    Just got my AP today, and was so excited to give it a go so updated the firmware, added the appropriate maps and flashed away. The map I'm using is the STG1-SUR2-TIH-98 even though I've got an aftermarket TMIC but until I install my internals I figured I'd stick to that.

    Anyway, to keep things simple, basically installed the map, but the car felt like it was bogged down from the get go! First, idle was low so it seemed like I was going to stall all the time. Secondly, it seemed like low end rpm torque was non existent. I had to be quite heavy footed to even get some boost going which isn't right at all. Coming from the Hypertech, I feel as though something isn't right here. And I know with even this map, the car should pull pretty hard.

    At the end of the day I really can't think of how I could've stuffed the process, and I don't imagine it to be my car either given it pulled pretty hard with the Hypertech so naturally it should be on par, if not better with the AP?

    Thanks for any input guys!

  2. #2

    Default

    i think it is recomended to have a a HPFP even if u run a stg1 map... might be pulling timing if it isnt getting enough fuel.

    im sure some of the other guys will chime in however you might want to data log it and put it up for assesment.

  3. Default

    You have to baby it for the first 50km or so... and by baby it i mean dont lead foot so the ECU remains in closed loop operation (fueling targets based on O2 sensor and MAF sensor). That will give the ECU to learn long term fuel trims. Once they settle (day or 2) the tune will feel much better, especially when you transition to Open loop operation (fuelling targets based on ECU tables and MAF sensor, no O2 sensor input).

    IT all hinges on Long Term Fuel Trims.

    If it doesnt settle in a few days I'd do a log on the AP and post them up.

    I recently installed mine and had to do the same. Now i get lots of wheelspin in 2nd gear!!

  4. #4

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    It just seems so unbearable to drive at the moment though. I mean, I understand what you mean for the first 50kms as it also applied to the Hypertech but it feels literally so sluggish at the moment, like worst than stock!

    Did it feel that way for you?

    I'm not sure if I can bear driving around like this, let alone the next 50kms!! lol

    Quote Originally Posted by allo80 View Post
    You have to baby it for the first 50km or so... and by baby it i mean dont lead foot so the ECU remains in closed loop operation (fueling targets based on O2 sensor and MAF sensor). That will give the ECU to learn long term fuel trims. Once they settle (day or 2) the tune will feel much better, especially when you transition to Open loop operation (fuelling targets based on ECU tables and MAF sensor, no O2 sensor input).

    IT all hinges on Long Term Fuel Trims.

    If it doesnt settle in a few days I'd do a log on the AP and post them up.

    I recently installed mine and had to do the same. Now i get lots of wheelspin in 2nd gear!!

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Car feels slow after Cobb AP flash

    Quote Originally Posted by Pistol Pete View Post
    i think it is recomended to have a a HPFP even if u run a stg1 map... might be pulling timing if it isnt getting enough fuel.

    im sure some of the other guys will chime in however you might want to data log it and put it up for assesment.
    Only with the plus intercooler stage 1 maps

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  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jmac View Post
    Only with the plus intercooler stage 1 maps

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    ok cool...
    I thought that if you had a TMIC it needed to be included in the tune selection.

  7. #7

    Default

    Might actually try the STG1 tune that includes the TMIC as well and see how that goes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pistol Pete View Post
    ok cool...
    I thought that if you had a TMIC it needed to be included in the tune selection.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Car feels slow after Cobb AP flash

    im on crapatalk so cant see signatures

    if you dont have a fuel pump upgrade i wount NOT recommend using the +IC map, its a requirement.

    yes, ideally you should match your map to the mods you have but in this case i believe you are better off to not.
    Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Tapatalk 2

  9. #9

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    i have no sig anyway! ha~ should take the time to add one!

    yeah i tried it out anyway since i was curious but practically same deal..

    i ended up uninstalling the AP tune(s) altogether and now back on Hypertech for the time being, instant happiness!! Bummer though, I'd hyped myself up for the AP for so long and now that I've got it, it doesn't wanna play nice!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jmac View Post
    im on crapatalk so cant see signatures

    if you dont have a fuel pump upgrade i wount NOT recommend using the +IC map, its a requirement.

    yes, ideally you should match your map to the mods you have but in this case i believe you are better off to not.
    Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Tapatalk 2

  10. #10
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    Default RE: Car feels slow after Cobb AP flash

    Well, if you want to sell the AP...

    Seriously though, as has been said, needs time to learn fuel trims, then log and post up.
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  11. Default Re: Car feels slow after Cobb AP flash

    The trims shouldn't be really what's affecting your car. Like said above once your wot the car uses the maf table and there Arnt any trims. Now I'm not trying to sell you a service with this but you may want to have someone to maybe play around with your tune. What people will come to find out is that the Cobb ots maps are far from a good tune. They are meant to work on the worst possible setup. Also I have seen a lot of fail with the stage one maps. I had a car that was hitting and holding 21psi on a stage 1 car. It was crazy. I would definitely not loose faith in the ap. Remember its not the ap its the map. The ap is simply a tool.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Car feels slow after Cobb AP flash

    funny you say that...
    this was my view of the AP stage 1 maps compared to hypertech.
    I think it has to do with how aggressive the HT tunes are compared to the AP.
    My stg2 tune is much better than the HT but the stg1 was not...

    Looks like you are investing in a HPFP..
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  13. #13
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    Default Re: Car feels slow after Cobb AP flash

    http://www.ozmpsclub.com/forum/showthread.php?p=218354

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  14. #14

    Default Re: Car feels slow after Cobb AP flash

    I've got a cpe dp + autotech internals staring at me right now just wanting to be installed!

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  15. #15

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    Update

    So I've had it on for 50kms+ and as I suspected, no change. Pretty adamant that it's not the tune/ap now. I feel now that something is up with my car as even after returning it to stock yesterday it ran, and still runs like a snail. It's been awhile since I've driven on the stock tune but I don't recall it being so bad. The problem is it seems the accelerator isn't as responsive and I really have to step on it just to get it going. Strange thing is on the Hypertech, the transformation was instant, power was there and responsiveness was never an issue. I still have the ap stg1 tune installed at the moment, but wouldn't know what things to check on the car that could potentially be causing this. As always, help is always appreciated!
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  16. #16
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    Default

    You will find that both the Hypertech & AP have very different throttle mapping, when I had the HT the throttle was very responsive at low speeds, even to the point where it was annoying at times i.e slow traffic, the AP however is a bit more docile on light throttle, but then ramps up once you jump on it, it takes a bit of getting used to.

  17. #17
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MattMPS3 View Post
    You will find that both the Hypertech & AP have very different throttle mapping, when I had the HT the throttle was very responsive at low speeds, even to the point where it was annoying at times i.e slow traffic, the AP however is a bit more docile on light throttle, but then ramps up once you jump on it, it takes a bit of getting used to.
    +1 to this. Same experience when I had the Hypertech vs COBB.
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  18. #18
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by levitize View Post
    Update

    So I've had it on for 50kms+ and as I suspected, no change. Pretty adamant that it's not the tune/ap now. I feel now that something is up with my car as even after returning it to stock yesterday it ran, and still runs like a snail. It's been awhile since I've driven on the stock tune but I don't recall it being so bad. The problem is it seems the accelerator isn't as responsive and I really have to step on it just to get it going. Strange thing is on the Hypertech, the transformation was instant, power was there and responsiveness was never an issue. I still have the ap stg1 tune installed at the moment, but wouldn't know what things to check on the car that could potentially be causing this. As always, help is always appreciated!
    Take it back to basics. Given it's UN-responsiveness on the stock tune, you need try and eliminate some stuff. The AP will help with logging. I think the Hypertech is masking the problem at low speeds.

    Check -

    1. TIP connections at both ends..make sure all clamps are tight

    2. Bypass Pass Valve hose connections.

    3. Could be the MAF sensor. When it the last time you cleaned it. (check this post - http://www.ozmpsclub.com/forum/how-t...t-sensors.html). Some of the images in this post have been removed, but scroll down to this one - http://www.ozmpsclub.com/forum/how-t...html#post53370

    4. TMIC hose connections both ends
    Trying to keep it subtle ... | COBB AccessPort | COBB DP | CP-e HPFP | CorkSport TMIC | TurboSmart BPV | Denso ITV22| CorkSport Boost Tubes | SURE Full3 Aeros | SURE REM (Street) | SURE AGS SS Shift Knob | 2XS SSP + SURE CounterShift | Speedline Front Strut Brace | Whiteline RSB | Prima Paint Protection

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattMPS3 View Post
    You will find that both the Hypertech & AP have very different throttle mapping, when I had the HT the throttle was very responsive at low speeds, even to the point where it was annoying at times i.e slow traffic, the AP however is a bit more docile on light throttle, but then ramps up once you jump on it, it takes a bit of getting used to.
    Thanks for the clarification Matt. I'm starting to realise the difference between the two and exactly what you mean about the throttle mapping. I've still got the Hypertech mindset but slowly getting used to difference, especially how you really need to readjust how you drive, or at least I am having to.
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  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by naasif View Post
    Take it back to basics. Given it's UN-responsiveness on the stock tune, you need try and eliminate some stuff. The AP will help with logging. I think the Hypertech is masking the problem at low speeds.

    Check -

    1. TIP connections at both ends..make sure all clamps are tight

    2. Bypass Pass Valve hose connections.

    3. Could be the MAF sensor. When it the last time you cleaned it. (check this post - http://www.ozmpsclub.com/forum/how-t...t-sensors.html). Some of the images in this post have been removed, but scroll down to this one - http://www.ozmpsclub.com/forum/how-t...html#post53370

    4. TMIC hose connections both ends
    Did all the above today, and took it for another drive tonight. Not sure if any of that made a difference but after also adjusting my driving according to COBB tunes I am pretty sure that my car is working the way it should be now. I think that coming from Hypertech I was unaware of the difference in terms of smoother (and later) power delivery but after doing some logs, it appears that I am hitting the boost target and fuel pressure seems to be holding up well at the moment, but unsure if all other log parameters are what they should be, so just a quick thanks for all the help and recommendations all though!

    I have 2 questions though;

    1. What are the AFR's supposed to be normally and when on boost? Mine seem to hover around 11~ when on boost.
    2. Has anyone tried to modify their idle rpm? I had mine on +200 on the Hypertech and was hoping to replicate that on the AP. I've found a guide and will give it a go soon.


    Edit ----------------------
    Found answer to question 1 in the COBB AP FAQ! lol
    Last edited by levitize; 22-10-2012 at 12:05 AM. Reason: Found answer to question one in Cobb AP FAQ! a duh! :p
    BLACK3MPS
    CORKSPORT|TMIC // SURE|AEROS // SURE|SIDEWINDER // SURE|RETURN // SURE|SHORTCUT // SURE|ANCHORS // SURE|COUNTERSHIFT // SURE|TORQ R3 // WHITELINE|RSB // MOOG|ENDLINKS // COBB|ACCESSPORT // CP-E|DOWNPIPE // AUTOTECH|INTERNALS

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