Can anyone tell me, what is the max width for a mps 6? Some one in the earlier comments said 255, but that doesnt sound right.
Can anyone tell me, what is the max width for a mps 6? Some one in the earlier comments said 255, but that doesnt sound right.
For the record im running 245/35 tyres on my 19s. Good size sidewalls. No rubbing and NO it's not sitting outside the guards. You want proof come check it out yourself. On the other hand I do have 18s 18x 9.5 +45 on 235/40. Now that sticks out about 2mm outside the guards. From what I got told any offset besides the manufacturers spec is illegal because even a +/- 1 would change the characteristic of the car
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And I'm running 245/40 on 19x8
Lowered in Eibach Pro springs and Koni FSDs. About 3cm
Although I think GenIIs are different to GenIs in how wide of a tyre it can take
This is @PremHK GenI running on 245/40 on 18x7.5
Peter "SLIXX"
Last edited by slixx; 14-12-2012 at 11:34 AM.
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CES "SS" TBE | SURE "Aeros" SRI | SURE "Sidewinder" TIP | SURE "Return" Recirc Hose | CUSTOM "PWR Core" FMIC | Hypertech "Tuned" | Turbosmart "Atmo" BOV | MSD DashHawk | CP-e REM | SURE "Anchors" Shifter Bushings | JBR SSP and Weight | JBR Heavy Knob |Redline Hood Quick LIFT ELITE | TEIN "SS" Coilovers | Front - Rear HOTCHKIS Swaybars | Front - Rear DBA 4000 Slotted Rotors | A1RM Brake Pads | 18x8 +45 Tenzo-R Cuzco Black V1 | 235/40/18 Michelin Pilot Super Sport | Safe n' Sound baby Seat lol
GIO is going to love this thread
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Just cuz it fits doesnt make it good or safe!
Now there you go just being silly..... :-p
When my new wheels arrive on the slow boat from Japan - i will post my next upgrade just for shits n giggles - 17x8 with 235's going to 20x11 and 285s.....just cos they fit.
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I'm currently looking at replacing a fairly conservative 225/45R18 on 18x7.5+48 fitment on my BK MPS3 and searching through the forum to gauge how much trouble the candidate fitments are likely to be. I'm actually wanting to push it further than the conservative fitment I originally ran with - and keep it legal and without rubbing. Exactly what this thread is all about - take it closer to the width limits.
This was always a contentious subject and I have no apology to make for leaning to the conservative. Discussion always seemed to include a great deal of assertions that are complete horseshit. To be clear, I'm NOT saying the 19x9+42 fitment is horseshit. My motivations for that last post - five years ago now (!) - were to ensure that the information provided was accurate.
The last few responses are quite interesting.
re: The 19x9+42 image:
(1) The suggested test was a plumb-line dropped from the guard while parked on a level surface, not a ruler against the guard. The flat surface on the guard is flat but not necessarily vertical, particularly if the guard has been rolled or pulled. So while the image shows you'd probably get away with it, it doesn't show that is a certain pass.
Likewise the 19x8.5+42 image demonstrates even less - at least when it comes to the assertion that it clears a pumbline:
The problem with both of these images is the use of a ruler against the flat of the guard instead of a plubline, and the probability of parallax error created by the camera perspective. This appears to be visible on the 9" wide fitment which shows what visually appears to be positive camber on the wheel. We can be very confident it's not running positive camber, so we can be equally confident these are not authoritative images. The point to make is to show without question what is legally viable and what is not. Neither of these images show this. the 19x8.5+42 image also shows the parallax error or guard-not-square displacing the ruler because the 18x8.5+42 fitment appears to have less clearance than the 19x9+42.
This is mathematically impossible and proves without any doubt that neither of these images can be relied on as an authoritative test result. The mocking that followed these images being posted is a good example of why I've taken a slightly conservative stance. Now that I operate this forum, it is even more important to me now that people get accurate information than it was then.
Yes, they DO show what is certainly the absolute limits you might be able to get away with but they don't prove them to be legal in terms of the under-the-guards test - there remains reasonable doubt.
A PLUMBLINE dropped from the guard - a tiny sinker at the end of some fishing line - with the sinker sitting just above the ground where it can nestle up near the shoulder of the tyre if necessary (it will be with these fitments) - dropped from the center/top of the guard while parked on a level surface is a test that will be much more accurate.
Lastly it appears neither of these images show legal fitments because a 1" wider rule applies to the rims. I am considering 8.5" rims for my BK and having done my homework, it looks like I will need to contact the state authority and get approval to fit it because going by the book, 8" wide is the AU legal limit for a BK (released with 7" wide rim) - the saving grace for an 8.5" BK fitment could be the BL series being released with a 7.5" wide rim. There could be some variation in rules state to state, I am checking against VIC law now having moved to VIC this year.
By the book, neither of these fitments are legal in VIC, and the images provided do not clearly demonstrate anything except that IF they pass, they are the absolute limit. Unfortunately they don't demonstrate that they pass.
Last edited by Nexus; 27-12-2017 at 07:38 PM.
"Blue Meanie" 2007 Aurora Blue MPS 3 - 18x8.5+44 SSR GTX01 - 235/40R18 Michelin PS5 - 3.5" ETS TMIC - CPE stg 2 mount - HKS/CPE BPV - 2XS inlet - 2XS short shift - Corksport turbo manifold - HT 98 octane tune - Leather/Aluminium handbrake - Momo shifty knob - 7" touchscreen - JDM Mazda Retractable dashtop screen assembly - Bespoke Raspberry Pi Android based GPS/Carplay and instrumentation - 36AH reserve battery and C-TEK isolator - TEIN Street Advanced coilovers 1" drop - Superpro bushings - 220Kw/410Nm.
"Lipstick" 2013 Velocity Red MPS 3 - 18x7.5+48 Enkei RPF1 -225/40R18 Federal RS-RR - CPE TMIC - COBB inlet - CPE stg 2 mount - COBB Stage 1 98 octane tune - COBB shifty knob - 2XS short shift - 2XS turbo manifold.
Here's the more extreme fitments I am considering. To be frank, thinking this through has nearly convinced me to just recondition the 18x7.5+48 I have and stick with 225/45R18, or go for the known good fitments of 18x8+48 or 18x8+50 with 225/45 or 235/40. Maybe even 245/40. I'm aware of some MPS6 running 245/40R18 on 18x8+50 RX8 wheels. Enkei has some good wheels at these sizes.
But looking to go further than that, looked at SSR because they make awesome wheels using an excellent manufacturing process and well, just because. Below is all considering street legal and appropriate use and assumes that having done this homework, such a fitment can pass an engineering inspection if required for it to be approved.
Without getting into the small detail of scrub radius etc, did some research and here's my updated blab on the subject:
Considerations:
Offset affects your handling as well as how you're wheels sit on the road. The same tyres fitted at +40 offset will be likely to show torque steer effects and steering wheight effects comapred to OEM +52.5.
Wide tyre fitments at high offset will risk fouling the suspension. ( A bit of hunting around the net shows 18x8.5+48 rim about 6mm from the strut and fitted with 225/45R18 the tyre clearing springs by about 5mm. 235/40 would not be a good fitment to this rim)
To minimise unwanted handling effects such as greater torque steer, it's a good idea to keep the inside track of your tyre (the inside edge of the contact patch that happens to be closest to the steering axis) in about the same position. To acheive this, for each 10mm increase in tyre width you should lower the offset 5mm.
From experience:
215/45R18 (OEM) --> 225/45R18 fitted to +52.5 OEM rim will show slightly heaver steering. the inside track has moved inward 5mm from stock.
215/45R18 (OEM) --> 225/45R18 fitted to +48 rims - steering weight about same. No notable negative influences. Rear guards good idea to roll (doesn't touch guard normally but tyre deformation in enthusiastic cornering can move it that mm or two necessary to foul guard lip. example circumstance is a suspension bump mid corner. Also requires plastic trim protruding into rear well from rear "mudflap" trim trimmed back a few mm. 225/40 unlikely to see this issue as diameter of tyre is about 10mm less, meaning there's more clearance to come components.
My original 18x7.5+48 was chosen as a best fit for 225/45R18 or 225/40. I chose 45 profile because diameter increase = more traction, it makes the speedo more accurate not less (within legal limits), and it looks fat by filling the arches out more. When lowering, care must be taken to avoid the tyres rubbing wheel well trim plastics under heavy compression - i.e. directly above the tyre, and also at steering lock angles in front of the tyre with steering at full lock. Again 225/40 to as much as 245 are less likely to see the same issues due to diameter difference. May see others though.
offset vs section width formula is expected to give good results up to two width increases (to 235/40 for example)
As you go to widest possible tyres - say 245/40 this formula is not as helpful and steering effects are theoretically going to become more noticable due to overall section width. The formula also now produces an illegal offset of +37.5 - with small variation around AU, your lowest legal offset is +40. I can't speak from experience (yet) but at these section widths letting the inside track move inwards (heavier steering observed going 215@+52.5 --> 225@+52.5) may prove a desirable geometry change
For 235/40R18 the formula suggests +42 offset. It's at the boundaries of minimal negative handling effects and I would feel best about 235 at +45, +48 offsets.A
245/40R18 suggests +38 offfset - not legal and (possibly) inviting the torque steer fairly to dance on your steering wheel. If it fits at all I'd feel best about this at +45 or so.
So the more aggressive fitments I'm considering moving to are (knowing I might need an engineering ticket to approve the wheel fitment):
18x8.5 +45 --> 48
Condidates
18x8.5+48 SSR GTV02 - look great but will sit too close to the suspension to safely fit 235/40 or higher.
18x8.5+44 SSR GTX01 - also look good, semi dish, expected OK for 235/40 and possibly even 245/40.
I really like the idea of fitting something more aggressive, but whether it's practical remains to be seen.
I need engineering tick in VIC, and I want to know if it's achievable before I buy.
I'll do a few tests and posts pics using measurements, visible plubline and guidelines again current 18x7.5+48 wheels. I'd really like to think the GTX01 @ +44 are going to pass and be happy with _at least_ 235/40 fitted.
In the process of working out if this is viable I'll be able to clarify if similar widths at +40 or +42 are viable. I've heard you can pull the guards out a surprisingly long way, so they may well be viable - if you are willing to go through the guard pulling and associated modding pain. I doubt that 9" +42 would ever genuinely pass, but will be able to give a good indication while I'm at it. Happy to prove my expectations wrong there.
"Blue Meanie" 2007 Aurora Blue MPS 3 - 18x8.5+44 SSR GTX01 - 235/40R18 Michelin PS5 - 3.5" ETS TMIC - CPE stg 2 mount - HKS/CPE BPV - 2XS inlet - 2XS short shift - Corksport turbo manifold - HT 98 octane tune - Leather/Aluminium handbrake - Momo shifty knob - 7" touchscreen - JDM Mazda Retractable dashtop screen assembly - Bespoke Raspberry Pi Android based GPS/Carplay and instrumentation - 36AH reserve battery and C-TEK isolator - TEIN Street Advanced coilovers 1" drop - Superpro bushings - 220Kw/410Nm.
"Lipstick" 2013 Velocity Red MPS 3 - 18x7.5+48 Enkei RPF1 -225/40R18 Federal RS-RR - CPE TMIC - COBB inlet - CPE stg 2 mount - COBB Stage 1 98 octane tune - COBB shifty knob - 2XS short shift - 2XS turbo manifold.
How do you think the 8.5 +44 would fit on a BK with 235 tyres.
I am contemplating 17 or 18 x 8.5 +40 to +45 and 235 tyres either 235/40/18 or 235/45/17
Current wheels on the BK I am purchasing are 18x8.75 +38 and they definitely poke as well as having an illegal offset
A couple of points from the NCoP for light vehicle modifications.
You can reduce offset by up to 12.5mm. So going up an inch on width and reducing offset by ½ inch puts all of the extra width outwards as poke.
There is no limit I know of about only going up an inch on rim size. You are allowed to go up to 30% wider on tyre width as long as it fits under the guard.
Clearance is not measured with a plumb bob. My understanding is that the a straight edge on the face of the wheel must point under the guard. Hence why the stance crowd run big cambers to keep things legal. This makes sense as a wheel will assume different angles at different loads so its quite legitimate for the bottom of the wheel to sit outside the guard under load. They are also playing to another loophole in some jurisdictions where the wheel can protrude as long as the tyre doesn't.
CX7 - The younger, taller and sexier replacement for the MPS6 and the first car designed around the MZR DISI
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G’day!
I’ve just acquired ssr gtx01 @ 18x8.5+44 and I’m feeling confident 235/40 will be a good fitment.
From my research 18x8.5+48 with 235 would have high risk of rubbing suspension.
I’m expecting the wheel face to be almost flush and needing some rear guard work roll and pull.
Re offset and poke - yep that’s right you are pushing the rim face and outside track out following the suggested width vs offset.
Only really a suggestion guide up to 235 from 215. Once you're thinking 235 or even wider, should probably let inside track move in slightly (less poke) if possible bearing in mind suspension clearance. for 18x8.5+44 with 235/40 inside track will move inward 1.5mm.
Re: 1” wider I’ve done some more research and it’s documented in vic but seems to be a guideline and ok provided engineering is sound. Asking around 8.5” will be considered fine and if queried the 7.5” fitment to BL is an engineering reference
re: Plumb line- yes a bit more research suggests test as described not entirely correct. New understanding is the wheel should not poke out if at 0 camber - that is to say top half of wheel must be under guard.
Variation to suggested test is to run string across the horizontal centre of the wheel face and drop plum line from guard to wheel centre. Plum line should fall in front of or intersect with horizontal string and not fall behind.
Deciphering all the guides and rules is not super straightforward and there is some variation state to state
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Last edited by Nexus; 18-01-2018 at 02:35 PM.
"Blue Meanie" 2007 Aurora Blue MPS 3 - 18x8.5+44 SSR GTX01 - 235/40R18 Michelin PS5 - 3.5" ETS TMIC - CPE stg 2 mount - HKS/CPE BPV - 2XS inlet - 2XS short shift - Corksport turbo manifold - HT 98 octane tune - Leather/Aluminium handbrake - Momo shifty knob - 7" touchscreen - JDM Mazda Retractable dashtop screen assembly - Bespoke Raspberry Pi Android based GPS/Carplay and instrumentation - 36AH reserve battery and C-TEK isolator - TEIN Street Advanced coilovers 1" drop - Superpro bushings - 220Kw/410Nm.
"Lipstick" 2013 Velocity Red MPS 3 - 18x7.5+48 Enkei RPF1 -225/40R18 Federal RS-RR - CPE TMIC - COBB inlet - CPE stg 2 mount - COBB Stage 1 98 octane tune - COBB shifty knob - 2XS short shift - 2XS turbo manifold.