Slow cranking but car is fine after it starts?

[Asher1337]

Hi all, having problem with starting. Car cranks for an extended period before kicking over. (Mazda 3 MPS 2006)


If the engine is on, then I turn it off and quickly on again will kick over normal the second time, always seems to be first time after it's been sitting for a little bit.


I have a new battery, fuel pump, pressure is fine, checked the earths. Car has done 80 000 k's and is very well maintained.


Any other ideas what it could be?


(Other things that come to mind is spark plug leads, connection between battery and ignition, starter motor, ignition....possible connection provlem)


Thanks for help

[TD]

I know mine does that when the battery terminals are a little loose, could be worth a look.

[Jrbris]

check battery and the terminalis as dan said .. your battery could be dieing..

[lup15]

he mentioned new battery, but maybe the new battery is a dud?

[guitar69]

he mentioned new battery, but maybe the new battery is a dud?

Sure, but if the terminal connections aren't tight, it may still not crank properly.

[Jrbris]

put a battery tester on it, id even do a alternator test.

check the cells are filled to the full line on the battery and ensure the battery has not boiled over. DO NOT OVER FILL the battery.

Failing that put a multimeter on the battery and start the car and see what voltage dipyou get and amps.

[lup15]

Sure, but if the terminal connections aren't tight, it may still not crank properly.

the terminal loose theory does not support why it works the second time round. it sounds like the battery isn't holding its charge. maybe there is an electrical drain somewhere?

[bd581]

Define "new" battery
Week old, month, year?
And don't forget, the battery could have been sitting around in the shop for a while.

Check water as mentioned. Also clean the terminals.

If its slow on the first start but ok after, without doing a proper test, it sounds like the beginning to every failed starter motor I have had in various cars.

[Asher1337]

Thanks for replies, pretty good feedback

Had this problem on a relatively new battery which I bought the car with...then bought a brand new battery a couple days ago, it's heavy duty official mazda battery and dry cell, after a battery test output is pretty much full

Starter motor could be possibility, thinking back I had a similar thing happen with Mazda 323 and it was the starter motor which went eventually

Pretty sure battery terminal is tight, but will check it just incase

[IceValk85]

these beasties use coil on plug, so there wont be any spark plug leads causing issues :P

Ice

[Asher1337]

Didn't know that, learnt something new

[OzCJ]

Have started to experience similar issues with slow cranking; ive done a test and had the battery on a trickle charger. Result, it cranked perfectly the first time then it struggled on the second.
Im going to check the terminals, but tending towards the prelim failure of the starter. Car has 49,500 on the ODO; will just have to hope that it keeps going till the service.

Initially I thought it was the key battery causing issues, but changed the battery and still the same issue.

[Duk]

Ignition coils, can sometimes crap themselves too.

Have you pulled out your spark plugs to check the condition???, if its not a spark problem or anything pre-spark. Then its probably a fuel related, . Could be the fuel pump relay .

Normally, you would do what you have already done, and work you way down the chain...

1. Check battery and/or terminal connection
2. Alternator.
3.Starter
3. Ignition Coil
4. Fuel Supply/pumps/
5. Relays related to Fuel pump

Judging from you scenario, i would assume the car starts better when warm, or at operating temp compared to a cold start. I'd had similar problems on other cars before, but it was vice versa to your situation,

[OzCJ]

Ignition coils, can sometimes crap themselves too.

Have you pulled out your spark plugs to check the condition???, if its not a spark problem or anything pre-spark. Then its probably a fuel related, . Could be the fuel pump relay .

Normally, you would do what you have already done, and work you way down the chain...

1. Check battery and/or terminal connection
2. Alternator.
3.Starter
3. Ignition Coil
4. Fuel Supply/pumps/
5. Relays related to Fuel pump

Judging from you scenario, i would assume the car starts better when warm, or at operating temp compared to a cold start. I'd had similar problems on other cars before, but it was vice versa to your situation,

Thanks for the reply, but the car has an extended crank before starting and its the first one after which its fine except of course if the car is off for an extended time. So I dont really know if its to do with the operating temp. I may have to call into the dealership for a diagnosis. No time to complete the checklist, but I would think its pretty lame after only 50,000k on the ODO.

[OzCJ]

OK, so the car was serviced this week, 50K and the issue mentioned to the dealership. But as usual, they couldnt fault it or the MDS didnt pickup any faults. Now Ive got 5 days of videos that prove otherwise and as I start the car leaving the service place, it cranks longer than usual. Thinking that I had lost my mind, drove home. The next morning, it starts up fine, then 10 hours later, the car cranks a lot, then kicks in eventually. Did a quick burst around the town, turned off the car, 2 hours later, same thing.

So it seems like it is a fuel system related issue, given that it cranks longer only after the car is driven. Given that it eventually starts, eliminates the batter & starter as the issue.

Could this be heat soak? While the engine is cooling its causing the fuel to expand or there is a air gap in the line somewhere? Any help anyone??

[OzCJ]

After much investigation and troubleshooting, here is the log of warranty repairs carried out till finally it was the...

1. Fuel pump assembly (within fuel tank) replaced under warranty (service centre diagnosis) - problem still there
2. HPFP replaced (part ordered from Japan) (Mazda Australia Tech diagnosis) - problem still there
3. Finally, EGR valve was found to have buildup. This was cleaned and now car is like new again

FYI, car had done around 45,000km

[Jrbris]

After much investigation and troubleshooting, here is the log of warranty repairs carried out till finally it was the...

1. Fuel pump assembly (within fuel tank) replaced under warranty (service centre diagnosis) - problem still there
2. HPFP replaced (part ordered from Japan) (Mazda Australia Tech diagnosis) - problem still there
3. Finally, EGR valve was found to have buildup. This was cleaned and now car is like new again


FYI, car had done around 45,000km

where is the EGR valve ?

[OzCJ]

where is the EGR valve ?

Its located towards the right hand bottom back of the engine (you facing the engine). Its got the plumbing to and from it. I'll post a pic when I can.