Tuning Round 1!

[GibbA]

Why do u want 2nd gear restrictions?? Also was it only the leaks causing the knock?

I wanted the restrictions because I find it pointless that when accelerating hard you would just spin the wheels. Waste of rubber on the wheels really. There is a certain amount of throttle control that can be used to overcome this (ie not just floor it) but it's much easier to do this through tuning. @Rayd can chime in as to what he exactly did to restrict this but it was a combination of things.
Basically we've brought it back so that it's just about to break traction, and does so uphill, but right at the limit on the flat, ie not asking the tyres to put down more power than they can handle in that gear.

And yes it appears that the intake leak was the main culprit for that. Obviously you get a little knock here and there during tuning as you're finding the maximum timing you can run, but yes the rich/lean and kr I was getting all disappeared when I fixed up that intake leak.
Really it was a tiny thing, clamp only firm and few minute cracks in the BPV tube, but apparently it was enough to be quite a problem.

I'm glad it was that, I didn't want to be forking out $400+ or however an O2 sensor costs!!

[GibbA]

I would be guessing @GibbA is getting too much power and can't get it to grip on the road

SOP

Yes my tyres were starting to look like this



So when I do my wmi tune I may start asking for 3rd gear restrictions.
That said after my tune I really don't like driving in the rain.. Torque curve is pretty harsh and 4th gear wheel spin is not what I'm wanting

Always engage SUPER CAREFUL driving mode when it rains.

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[Rob777]

I would be guessing @GibbA is getting too much power and can't get it to grip on the road

SOP

Yeh lol derr I gathered that! Maybe I should of asked why can't you control that with the throttle? Almost every car I've owned has been able to rip second gear hell some even 4th. Maybe I'm old school or just different to you guys but surely you can get the same result with a sensitive right foot?

[Rob777]

Anyway I love following your stuff Gibba!

[DAN MPS 3]

Maybe I'm old school or just different to you guys but surely you can get the same result with a sensitive right foot?

Pffffft, sensitive right foot. Lived my life by the Colin McRae Philosophy: if in doubt, flat out.

[slixx]

Yeh lol derr I gathered that! Maybe I should of asked why can't you control that with the throttle? Almost every car I've owned has been able to rip second gear hell some even 4th. Maybe I'm old school or just different to you guys but surely you can get the same result with a sensitive right foot?

Sorry Rob. No condescension was in my last note and I did find a bit funny you were asking

Lost in the interwebs translation me thinks

I guess working out its limits and then tuning the way @Rayd and @GibbA is just fine tuning it as where he would be is a long way off

You will always have to use your nouse and foot as the wear factor in the tyre will mean you will have to adjust.

The figures @GibbA is producing is super impressive and I would hazard a guess that the torque had to come down to bring it to somewhere sensible. At least just for 1-2

It's not play station racing yet!!!

[GibbA]

Yeh lol derr I gathered that! Maybe I should of asked why can't you control that with the throttle? Almost every car I've owned has been able to rip second gear hell some even 4th. Maybe I'm old school or just different to you guys but surely you can get the same result with a sensitive right foot?

Yes well you are right and there is a bit of that in there, BUT there are 2 other factors at play. Look at how fast the turbo spools. It's BAM on boost. I'm sure you know that too, but this is like -8 to 20psi in a fraction of a second on the little K04.. it's rather quick.

Add to that, I have gotten ray to make the throttle MORE sensitive. This to me is a better combination.
It's more sensitive and great response for normal and spirited driving, but a little too touchy for my to "finely" control when practically at WOT. This is why I prefer to have the tune sort traction out on WOT.

I dunno if this makes sense but that's how it works for me and works well. Increased sensitivity for normal daily driving and then traction controlled by tune for WOT. We're only talking 2nd gear though. All the others are just balls out

[Rayd]

As @GibbA mentioned, the last few maps were to find where Gibba's most preferred combination of throttle sensitivity + gear and boost restriction point was in various gears.

Note: this is completely user dependant; some people like a touchy throttle, others like a most linear feeling. Definitely makes driving and tuning the car very interesting for both owner and tuner!

[GibbA]

Thought throttle?

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[Rayd]

Thought throttle?

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Fixed
Damn auto correct hehe

[Rob777]

Sorry Rob. No condescension was in my last note and I did find a bit funny you were asking

The figures @GibbA is producing is super impressive and I would hazard a guess that the torque had to come down to bring it to somewhere sensible. At least just for 1-2

All good champ. I'm the first to admit my hopelessness in writing what I'm thinking lol

Yes well you are right and there is a bit of that in there, BUT there are 2 other factors at play. Look at how fast the turbo spools. It's BAM on boost. I'm sure you know that too, but this is like -8 to 20psi in a fraction of a second on the little K04.. it's rather quick.

Add to that, I have gotten ray to make the throttle MORE sensitive. This to me is a better combination.
It's more sensitive and great response for normal and spirited driving, but a little too touchy for my to "finely" control when practically at WOT. This is why I prefer to have the tune sort traction out on WOT.

I dunno if this makes sense but that's how it works for me and works well. Increased sensitivity for normal daily driving and then traction controlled by tune for WOT. We're only talking 2nd gear though. All the others are just balls out

Fair enough. All valid points. I suppose I'm using your MPS as my MPS template and it's all food for thought for when my tune gets done (praying I can afford or mrs will buy me an ap soon). Before holidays preferably.
But yeh we're same yr model and only difference I'm aware of is FMIC v TMIC and the tune obviously so I'm dam hoping I'll be seeing power very similar to yours.
The different ways of tuning it you mentioned ie: throttle sensitivity at WOT especially, and then restrictions is stuff I never considered. Sure I expect to have less traction in lower gears but always under the impression I could control with throttle. Or had to control with throttle. Restrictions wise, can't you just make it not go from 8 - 20 psi in a fraction of second. Surely you could stage it? But I'm no tuner or even ap owner for that matter.

Anyway I appreciate all your super informative posts and I follow very closely! Cheers!

[GibbA]

So you've got CP-e (or some other) turbo back exhaust?

Well i'm only really talking when I bury the throttle that it matter. That said, I was thinking of the possabillty of a low power or even a "rain" tune haha. Something with a lot less power, and more importantly, slower turbo spool, but this really isn't that possible. I mean if you tune so that the wg is open all the time, it'll still spool just as fast to spring pressure (8-10psi) and from then on I guess it's up to the tune how you control it.
All in all, best way is just not go WOT in the wet, just be careful, good sensitive and very responsive throttle all the time, and when you flatten it, no matter the gear you've got pretty good traction.

You can see in the graph I posted that it's got over 400nm under 3k rpm anyway so that doesn't help traction either. Going WOT at higher RPM when you're a little past peak torque you'll have much less traction issues, so that's where you get the "throttle control" from for keeping traction. Accelerate until you get to there, then you can flatten it and keep traction. That's what I found was best to keep traction earlier on in tuning when there were less restrictions.

[Rob777]

Ahh yes the dam exhaust. I always forget that. I was under impression you were DP only and only realised this the other day actually.
Yeh I'm test pipe only. Hopefully DP soon tho.

[slixx]

When I was tuning with Stratified, I asked him to make the throttle more responsive.

Really helps me with day to day driving and help control how much power I need when fanging about

Definitely worth it

[chef]

Dam that's a lot of torque at 3000 I don't make 400nm till 3500 and 500 nm till 4300

[GibbA]

Dam that's a lot of torque at 3000 I don't make 400nm till 3500 and 500 nm till 4300

Yeah certainly is. Is a decent kick in the pants


So I did my final logs tonight on my final revision.



Also did a 2nd 3rd 4th log, sent both to Ray and he's happy as well!

So final Vd figures of 204kw 428nm, will be interesting to see how close this will actually be on the dyno!


Also got a video of my 2nd 3rd 4th log, which also included a few seconds worth of 5th in there because it's always fun



Got the FFS gear changes pretty down pat, and damn she moves out!


Also attached the final 4th WOt log.

Ambient Temperature = 13c
Max g/s = 271

60-100mph = 5.158s My best yet! WooHoo!

Thanks @Rayd for each step of this process, look forward to my meth tune and coming back for round 2!

[SarcasticOne]

Max g/s = 371

60-100mph = 5.158s My best yet! WooHoo!

Thanks @Rayd for each step of this process, look forward to my meth tune and coming back for round 2!

that g/s has to be a typo

[GibbA]

that g/s has to be a typo

Is it because I didn't write the decimal places?
I think you can forgive me for that , look at the time I made the post Haha.

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[chef]

Does she hold traction in 2nd with the added restrictions in place?
good work @Rayd numbers look good

[slixx]

Wicked 60-100mph time
I calculated it at 5.24

First 60 to first 100